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#98256 - 2003-05-01 01:03 AM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
MCA Offline
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Registered: 2000-04-28
Posts: 5152
Loc: Netherlands, EU
Dear,

See our signature.
greetings.
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#98257 - 2003-05-01 05:05 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Lonkero Administrator Offline
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Registered: 2001-06-05
Posts: 22344
Loc: OK
like already said before, that bumbing is not right word for non-active posts.
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#98258 - 2003-05-01 05:24 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Les Offline
KiX Master
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Registered: 2001-06-11
Posts: 12734
Loc: fortfrances.on.ca
I don't understand MCA's obsession with post counts. There are the stats that the board returns that includes all posts, even those that have been deleted. MCA crawls the site and counts the number of posts that have not been deleted. The net difference is the now infamous "bump count". Some members, but mostly moderators will "bump" a topic to the top by posting a reply to it and then deleting it. That is true "bumping".

I will often post to a thread and then later delete it, not to "bump" the thread, but rather to keep the content cleaner. My board count will vary from MCA's by the number of true "bumps" and the number of replies I (or others) have deleted. Also, I should note that other moderators have deleted some of my posts as well.

Personally, I don't really care if the board count does not match MCA's, but I do care if MCA accuses anyone of deliberately inflating their post count.
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#98259 - 2003-05-01 05:58 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Jack Lothian Offline
MM club member
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Registered: 1999-10-22
Posts: 1169
Loc: Ottawa,Ontario, Canada
Les,

Because MCA's first language is not english, sometimes he comes across as gruff, abrupt, and negative when he doesn't really intend that. I suspect that he didn't intended his remark to be interpretated this way.

While I don't share MCA's obvious enjoyment of statistical & numerical analysis, I do like his site & I think he adds a dimension to the board that would be missed.

MCA,

I don't think "bumping" is a good term for these missing posts since they can result from other actions. Why not refer to them as "deleted" posts or "missing" posts. Call them what they are & I think there will be less controversy.
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#98260 - 2003-05-01 08:50 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Les Offline
KiX Master
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Registered: 2001-06-11
Posts: 12734
Loc: fortfrances.on.ca
Jack,
You needn't come to MCA's defense. He can defend himself. I don't get the impression that "he comes across as gruff, abrupt, and negative when he doesn't really intend that". I on the other hand, do come across as gruff, abrupt, and negative and often do intend that.

quote:
Question 2: who has highest 'bumping' counter.
Answer: soon we will return this answer.

My bet is that the one with the highest "bump" count is also a significant contributor (not like me).
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#98261 - 2003-05-01 08:57 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Lonkero Administrator Offline
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Registered: 2001-06-05
Posts: 22344
Loc: OK
well I know highest bumb volume top5 already.
I see that MCA is going to release that info too.

but, as known, that value MCA is going to release is not true if said to be as bumbing.

as the bumbers have also deleted posts by others means.

and...
I can understand jacks comments but I think les is right on this one.
doesn't matter what MCA's intension was, his new listing will bring up the word: "who has highest volume of bad replies/posts"

thus this ranking is not good as it will not give credit to the persons but will create opposite feelings.
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#98262 - 2003-05-01 09:13 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Lonkero Administrator Offline
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Registered: 2001-06-05
Posts: 22344
Loc: OK
also, this kindoff hit list would need to have a postcount relative.

like percents of postcount thus making known the relevance of noobie bumbing and high poster having real loosed posts.
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#98263 - 2003-05-01 09:15 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Sealeopard Offline
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Registered: 2001-04-25
Posts: 11163
Loc: Boston, MA, USA
Can somebody fill me in as to why we need to know wwho's bumping what, or deleting their posts? Apart from the fact, that it is technically possibel to create this particular statistic, what's the benefit of it? I do see the value in the other stats, though.
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#98264 - 2003-05-01 09:18 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Jack Lothian Offline
MM club member
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Registered: 1999-10-22
Posts: 1169
Loc: Ottawa,Ontario, Canada
Les,

I agree with all your points except the one about you intending to be negative. Gruff yes, but rarely negative. [Big Grin]

What MCA is calling bumping is not really bumping. I have bumped a topic to the top on several occasions by generating a reply with no comment & I don't think MCA's stat counts this as a bump. On the other hand, I have deleted topics where I decided my contribution added nothing & I believe MCA's stat would call this bumping. Also, doesn't the profile post count also include the personal messages passed through the board? If so, doesn't this muddy the waters significantly?

Because of a number of factors, I believe enumerating the "biggest bumpers" [Wink] is specious & irrelevant.

The post count that MCA prefers might be more rightly called "current accessible posts". There is an implication that non accessible historical posts should not be counted.

In the end Les, I think we are coming from the same place. ie. All posts are positive contributions in some manner so why not accept the literal count stored in the profile.

PS: Jooel, I didn't feel that I was disagreeing with Les but we do have a tendency to give the appearance that we are disagreeing even when we support the same point of view. [Roll Eyes]

[ 01. May 2003, 21:24: Message edited by: Jack Lothian ]
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#98265 - 2003-05-01 09:18 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Lonkero Administrator Offline
KiX Master Guru
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Registered: 2001-06-05
Posts: 22344
Loc: OK
no, it's not technically possible currently to show the stats of bumbers.
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#98266 - 2003-05-01 09:24 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Les Offline
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Registered: 2001-06-11
Posts: 12734
Loc: fortfrances.on.ca
If I Google "biggest bumpers", I get at least one interesting hit. [Big Grin] [Big Grin]
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#98267 - 2003-05-01 09:31 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Jack Lothian Offline
MM club member
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Registered: 1999-10-22
Posts: 1169
Loc: Ottawa,Ontario, Canada
Les,

I will have to take your word for it. I suspect if I tried this google search, I might receve a nasty note from security. [Eek!]
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#98268 - 2003-05-01 10:48 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Kdyer Offline
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Registered: 2001-01-03
Posts: 6241
Loc: Tigard, OR
ditto
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#98269 - 2003-05-02 03:37 AM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
MCA Offline
KiX Supporter
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Registered: 2000-04-28
Posts: 5152
Loc: Netherlands, EU
Dear,

Indeed people could think in another direction, when we call it "bumping" counter.
Jack returns the exact explanation for it. It is the result of "missing" posts,
but all the feedback shows that choosing a correct name can be very hard. So
"bumping" counter is more than "missing" posts (see later).

Just by choosing our name for it enough people are interesting. At least our input
returns enough positive feedback to get a proper list (see later reactions).

Les, we don't mean any negative with our "bumping" counter. We don't accuses anyone.
To prevent it we will use another name for it. Just adding such list prevents that
other persons must do the calculations which is already possible. All required infor-
mation for our "missing post"-list is already available on our statistical pages
(in our version: only people with over 100 posts can become a member of it).
It was just inspired when Jens and you are trying (at least it looks like a neck-and-neck
race) to get and to keep the second position on our active postcounter lists, but his
speed was already enormous this year.
Inspired, when we see a big differences between the two of you. Of course it doesn't mean,
that "missing"/"deleted" posts aren't relevant contributions.

Jooel, you are right. The missing posts counter is a combination of deleted and bumping
posts. We can't see which of the two was choosing. The problem becomes even harder,
when other people (= moderators can do it with a very good reason) are deleting someone's
posts. Also when we had to deal with the influence of private message's it makes this
issue more complex.
So Jack's suggestion is a very good one.
Of course the postcount must be a relative one. Also a good suggestion.
Since the latest upgrade of our statistical pages we make sometimes some small extensions
to it. For an easier way of reading. For making trends much easier to see.

About a definitive name we find again a new obstacle. The available posts on moderator
forum
are inaccessible and invisible for normal members, but we include them in our
"active post counter" lists.
We have the intentsion to can call it the "inaccessible" list.
Other suggestions?
greetings.
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#98270 - 2003-05-07 06:33 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
MCA Offline
KiX Supporter
*****

Registered: 2000-04-28
Posts: 5152
Loc: Netherlands, EU
Dear,

We have update our statistical pages. The inaccessible list isn't included
at this moment. We will publish it as a post entry.

Amazing was the very low about of posts during April 2003. Only 2.629 entries and 255 new topics.

greetings.

(our reaction 4600+ to the board)

[ 12. May 2003, 10:55: Message edited by: MCA ]
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#98271 - 2003-05-07 06:42 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Kdyer Offline
KiX Supporter
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Registered: 2001-01-03
Posts: 6241
Loc: Tigard, OR
MCA,

While your statistics are great.. Are there any Web Logs that we can view? Something like that of WebTrends, or Analog?

Kent
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#98272 - 2003-05-07 07:11 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
MCA Offline
KiX Supporter
*****

Registered: 2000-04-28
Posts: 5152
Loc: Netherlands, EU
Dear,
No, greetings.
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#98273 - 2003-05-07 07:30 PM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
Kdyer Offline
KiX Supporter
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Registered: 2001-01-03
Posts: 6241
Loc: Tigard, OR
Correct me if I am wrong.. I thought Henri showed us the page hits per month. I don't have the site in front me. We were seeing about 60,000 hits a month (probably off).

Kent
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#98274 - 2003-05-10 12:43 AM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
MCA Offline
KiX Supporter
*****

Registered: 2000-04-28
Posts: 5152
Loc: Netherlands, EU
Dear,

Indeed some pages on the kixtart.org are pointing to some statistical information.
F.e. on the main-page you will find the related nedstat icon.
greetings.
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#98275 - 2003-08-20 04:42 AM Re: BB-INFO: TOP25 & other statistics now available (like full index & MM Club)
MCA Offline
KiX Supporter
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Registered: 2000-04-28
Posts: 5152
Loc: Netherlands, EU
Dear,

The information of last period has been included in our statistical pages (BB info + BB statistics).

Some remarks
  • the amount of reactions is growing again.
  • the amount of reactions by none TOP25 members is growing also.
  • during the last months we receive a lot of alerts about unreachability of this site.
  • general discussions forum is growing very fast. Within one year it contains over 1.000 topics.
  • UDF forum is receiving still a great amount of new UDF's.
  • Chris S. is a new member of our BB MM club page.
  • Lonkero is going for the 10.000 reactions coming months. Good luck.
greetings.


btw: a delay in releasing those info by personal circumstances. Sorry, when you were waiting
for it.
Also we had miss the third Anniversary of our site. Thanks for all your input, comments and questions.
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